|
||
|
Title: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 22nd, 2008, 2:02am With the cost of Petrol being on average £1.04 a litre & with no sign of it ever dropping (due to US & UK wanting to conquer & govern the whole planet ???), & also the chance that Brown is going to stick another 2 pence on a litre come April >:(..... my 2.3 Scorp taxi is becoming too uneconomical for me to earn a decent living >:( So time for action......... .....I either sell my perfectly running, 78k on new engine & autobox Scorp (mileage reads 176K), that's had in the last 2 years........ ...... brand new wishbones & wishbone rear bushes, brand new strut mounts & bearing rings (2 weeks ago), brand new anti roll bar bushes & clamps, brand new drop links, new steering rack & track rod ends, brand new heater matrix, new rad, new inlet manifold, brand new exhaust manifold & cat gaskets, every engine sensor replaced with brand new sensors, including the HO2 sensor, brand new water pump, new aircon pump & re-gas, new alternator, new P/S pump, 2 brand new Michelin Pilots & brand new discs & pads all round recently......& few more bits & pieces :) Also has been running on 5W/30 fully synthetic oil for the last 30K miles....does make the engine smoother & quieter 8) Last week it sailed through the MOT & this week it sailed through the more rigorous licenced taxi MOT test :D So after all this work (& hands that are now, as tough as old leather), I'm a bit reluctant to sell it for the peanuts that it is worth on the second hand market :( I love this car (almost as much as my MK1 Granny :o) & my passengers always comment on how it is the most luxurious taxi on the rank (better than the new Mondeo apparently ;)). They say that it's an extremely clean & well kept car & can't believe it when I tell them it's ten years old..... 8).......So selling it would be a shame :( I couldn't afford to buy a similar spec car without getting a mortgage size loan, & I reckon I can get at least another 2-3 years out of this Scorp ;) So it's looking like an LPG conversion is the only option :D I've done a little bit of research & have found that a brand new multipoint sequential conversion can cost as little as £1200 all in, or a second hand system can be fitted for about £700. Any advice please from anyone in the know :).....Baz & Petehull especially ;) |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Simmo on Feb 22nd, 2008, 6:26am Does Baz know about LPG then ???? :o :o. |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by scorpio_man on Feb 22nd, 2008, 10:52am hi jc lpg is great. in the 4 years that i've had my system, the price of gas has went up from 33.9ppl to 49.9ppp (petrol 75pp to 101pp), so some saving. you need to get a multi point system at the very least (that's what i've got), though sequential ones are better. single points one are far too old now a days. you will need to fit the towing spring (you say your car is too low at the back) as the tank is very heavy (3 times as thick as a petrol tank (at least). it also need to go in the spare wheel well as i think you won't (as in not allowed :-/) get airport work if it's in the car (boot). i think mike stated this. re getting the job done. you need to get/find someone who knows what they're doing. on my car, you need to check it's on gas as it's set up that good. if going down the new system route, i'd use autogas2000 (http://autogas2000.co.uk/). the owner is a guy called chris. see this. (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/lpg2.3_2.htm) it takes about 3 days to fit the system, so you would need to find a small hotel or b&b nearby. re fuel consumption. i get about the same on gas as petrol (19mpg town/ 27mpg m/way) hth |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Tons_of_fun on Feb 22nd, 2008, 5:19pm I agree with scorpio man.LPG is excellent & was the only way i could afford to run a V8 range rover.As said single point systems are now old hat & can run out of tune very easily,so multi or sequential is the way to go.Self fitting isnt too difficult BUT a proper setting up of the system is esential.The only snag i found was with the spare wheel sized tanks had limited capacity (usually 50-60 ltrs) which was fine for day to day runs but useless for a trip to the coast (only ever got 12 mpg on a run :o :o :o).Either way it,s bound to save you money (lpg is 42 ppl here in brum).With the miles you do J C you should make that back in no time ;D ;D ;D |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 22nd, 2008, 5:21pm Thanks for the info guys :) P.S....sorry Andrew, I forgot you had PLG as well ;) |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by scorpio_man on Feb 22nd, 2008, 5:40pm on 02/22/08 at 17:21:47, jonnycab wrote:
i do???? ;D }{ |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by adam on Feb 22nd, 2008, 8:47pm Hi JC, i too have a 2.3 lpg conversion. Agree fully with everything said. You may have a problem with the lpg tank size and fitting in suitcases for your passengers. I have the tank fitted where the spare is with a false floor and space is limited. I dont carry a spare for this reason but carry a can of emergency foam just in case, this may not also suit you as a professional driver. |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Highlander on Feb 22nd, 2008, 9:44pm I've bought two 2.3 estates which were taxis, both had been replaced by Skoda Octavia's as they are seemingly the best for running costs?? Last guy reckoned the Skoda cost 2/3 of what the Scorpio did to run :-/ |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by peteHull on Feb 22nd, 2008, 11:38pm Hi Jc I agree with everything people have said and would strongly recomend haveing it fitted Proffessionaly I have had absolutely no problems whatsoever with mine and it must have paid for itself by now. The only problem I see is with the tank size and position. I have a 90ltr tank between my shock absorber top mountings so have lost half the boot space (not a problem for me) when I fill it up I can only get 62 litres in the tank at a time cos it retains so much when it is empty for safety reasons (don't know why...) Doughnut tanks are ok but you lose the spare wheel space and have to fillit more frequently. Everytime you fill up it is costing you half of what it would in petrol, I put £20 of petrol in about every 3 months or so cos it always starts on petrol and automatically switches over after about quater of a mile (same place everyday) The performance (in my opinion) is much more responsive although my engine needs some tweaking at the minute (plugs etc) and it certainly does not hesitate when starting from standstill. Here is a link to the prins website where you can get more info.... http://www.prinslpgnetwork.com/ Hope this is of help to you jon any further questions? don't hesitate to ask.... Best wishes Pete ;D |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 23rd, 2008, 1:41am Thanks again guys for all the advice & info :) I was thinking of a doughnut tank in the spare wheel hole (don't mind filling it up everyday) as the boot tank would obviously take up alot of space. My only problem is what to do with the spare wheel ?.....According to council regulations, all licenced taxis must carry a spare wheel. This is an old law & if challenged, may be re-thought.....seeing as new Galaxy's don't carry spare wheels, they just have emergency foam, & there are a few of these that are licenced :) If I don't get any joy with my challenge then I suppose I could always buy a wheel rack to fit on the boot. At least then I could stiil have the spare & a boot full of luggage ;)....or maybe even get a roof box :) Or better still, do like the airlines do & have a baggage limit ;D |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 23rd, 2008, 2:08am on 02/22/08 at 21:44:48, Highlander wrote:
Stuart, you forgot to type in the punchline ;D A Skoda ???....please ::).......I don't think I could live with the constant embarrasment :-[ Seriously though, a pal has a Skoda Octavia & it has zero legroom, the seats are rock solid & have no comfort value whatsoever & it feels & sounds like it's made from recycled coke cans & plastic bottles ??? Talk about sacrificing a fine roast beef dinner in favour of a doner kebab ::)........ ;D |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Baz on Feb 23rd, 2008, 2:47am Well mine has LPG and I love it.... cheap as chips to run and I had the added advantage of buying the whole kit 2nd hand and having it fitted by someone else for only a few hundred quid (don't you love EBay!!??) The kit on mine is the one which was on Steve's car shown on the main site http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/svilpg.htm But I wasn't sure I had mentioned that I had it fitted thats all!! ::) |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Simmo on Feb 23rd, 2008, 6:50am :D :-X |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by martin_rowe on Feb 23rd, 2008, 8:32am 90L tank should hold 72L on a fill up from empty (80%) you should be able to run it dry if you want, the 20% is an expansion space, as you can not compress a liquid, if tank isnt emptying may be not positioned correctly. (valve block has to be at the right angle) some tanks have an arrow pressed into them to indicate horrizontal, otherts have a sticker. |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by PeteB on Feb 23rd, 2008, 3:20pm Have you considered looking for a TD ? After having a 2.0 petrol in the past the MPG on the diesel is far superior. Since having the TD model I would never go back to any thing else ! Pete |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 24th, 2008, 3:59am I've driven a brand new TD Scorp back in 1997 as a private hire vehicle, & although it was quick, it didn't like all the around town work & the you could literally watch the fuel guage drop when doing airports ??? Overall, I don't think that the 2.5 TD is any more economical that the 2.3 petrol when you take into consideration the servicing costs & price of diesel :) The same engine is/was used in the Metrocab & was considered very problematic & highly inferior to the 2.7 Toyota diesel engine that was fitted to the TX1....plus it sounds like a tractor & wakes up the whole neighbourhood when you drop off a fare at 3 o'clock in the morning ::)...... ;D |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by scruffygyt on Feb 24th, 2008, 9:57am don't mean to be picky but its a 2.7 NISSEN engine in tx1 |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 24th, 2008, 10:56am Sorry, you're right....got the country of origin right though ;) I don't mean to be picky, but it's spelt NISSAN ;D |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by peteHull on Feb 25th, 2008, 6:42am on 02/24/08 at 10:56:06, jonnycab wrote:
;D }{ ;) |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by scruffygyt on Feb 25th, 2008, 10:31pm dont you just hate smart ar?es |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 26th, 2008, 1:05pm ........... ;D |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by dan_the_man on Feb 26th, 2008, 4:57pm how about a space saver spare wheel and a tin of foam ! Keep the Beauty Jc . |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 27th, 2008, 7:38pm Today, I spoke to 3 LPGA approved fitters to get some quotes... The first one quoted £1650 & it would take 3-4 days. He said he only fitted BRC kits as they are by far the best & he never has trouble with them. He also said that because all Fords had soft valve seats (I thought it was just old lead engines :-/), then a special filter/gagdet thingy was also included in the price to prevent the gas from ruining the valve seats....fair enough :-/ The second one quoted £1400 for a Bi-gas kit or £1500 for a Prinz kit & said it would take 2 days. I asked him about BRC kits & he reckoned they were one of the worst on the market as the injectors keep stuffing up ???.....he also said there was no need for the special filter/gadget thingy as it was only the Focus that had soft valve seats ??? So thats 2 LPGA approved fitters who seem to be contradicting each other, both on which kit is the best & what type of valve seats the engine has :-/ Now I'm getting confused ::) As for the third fitter....he quoted me £2000 & said it would take a week ???.....That was the end of that conversation ;) |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Simmo on Feb 27th, 2008, 9:13pm Jon, Have you contacted the people Andrew used and mentioned in his post??. They seem to be the bees knees and clearly gave Andrew good service. Perhaps they would referee the advice from the two firms you mention?. Mike. :) |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by scorpio_man on Feb 27th, 2008, 9:34pm hi jc autogas2000 are quoting £1500 (+VAT?) for a galaxy 2.3. hth |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by peteHull on Feb 27th, 2008, 10:03pm on 02/27/08 at 19:38:21, jonnycab wrote:
JC all I can say is that if you ring this number and ask for Blair (Not Tony) he will give you all the information (which is reliable) He is a VERY knowledgable and caring chap. 01482 807506 tell him I recommended him to you. hth Pete |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 27th, 2008, 10:33pm Mike & Andrew....no, I haven't contacted autogas 2000, purely because they are so far away. But if they really know what the Scorp needs, then maybe they could recommend a good fitter a bit closer to home....I'll give them a ring tomorrow ;) But to be honest, I'm starting to have second thoughts about spending so much cash on converting this car to LPG when the car is probably only worth half of the conversion cost :-/ At £1500 for the conversion, then I estimate it will take me about 8 months to break even :) I'm confident that this car has at least another 2 years of service life & all money spent on it is tax deductable ;) But the one thing that is still niggling at the back of my brain is....is it worth spending so much money on a ten year old car ?.....or would it be better spent on another newer car ? :-/ My heart is saying "yes, keep the car & spend the money"....but my common sense is saying no @ ... "buy a newer car & get that converted to LPG...or... buy a newer car that is already converted to LPG" ::).....& then try & convince the wife that she want's a Scorp & register it in her name :) The most annoying thing about this is....I would like to get cheaper fuel.....but am also concerned about the pollution we are leaving behind for our children to grow up in :( LPG is a good fuel which doesn't throw out anywhere near as many toxins as petrol or diesel, but it's so expensive to convert...even some manufacturers that used to offer dual fuel options, are no longer doing it ??? It seems that trying to save the planet is more expensive than trying to kill it :(..... |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Scorpio_Mike on Feb 27th, 2008, 10:51pm My 2 cents - If you will save £1500 in just 8 months then surely it makes sense to go for the conversion - the fuel savings from the next 16 months are money in the bank ! Sell the car in 2 years time, well maintained and with the LPG conversion you should get a good price for it. If you buy a newer car you will probably lose the £1500 in depreciation in 8 months - and you STILL might be thinking about an LPG conversion for the replacement car. I realise you get lots of tax deductibles etc...but what would you replace your Scorpio with and would it really be that much more economical ??? Have you thought about what the replacement would be ? Keep the Scorpio and go for the conversion I say :) :) :) |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by jonnycab on Feb 27th, 2008, 11:06pm ...."Have you thought about what the replacement would be ?" I quite like the Peugeot 607....good looking car with lots of room......maybe that's a reason why I'm thinking that it isn't worth spending the money on the Scorp :-/ As I said though....although my wife is fed up with driving 'hand-me-down' ex-taxi's ;D....maybe the Scorp may be a different proposition altogether.....she's always said how comfy it is & loves all the gadgets :) But I must admit Scorpio_Mike, you do make a good arguement in favour of keeping the Scorp & converting it ;) |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Scorpio_Mike on Feb 28th, 2008, 11:44am Peugeot 607 :o :o :o Nice looking car but...personally I absolutely detest French cars and would NEVER even consider buying one, either new or used...so many stories from friends and work colleagues about the things that have gone wrong on them, the cost of repairs and the cost of replacement parts have put me off for life ( Citroen C5 HID sealed headlight unit anyone ? £500 please :o ) - guy from work bought a 3 year old C5 for about £3,000 - perhaps not the bargain he thought it was...especially when the other headlight failed a few weeks later. Big French cars are also famed for their heavy depreciation. Yes, I know you get tax breaks as it is a vehicle used for work. Spend the £1500 on the conversion, I doubt you will regret it. |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by martin_rowe on Feb 28th, 2008, 1:19pm I run all my scorps on LPG (2.3 est as works van & 24v saloon as familey car)wouldnt use any other fuel. as far as vavle seats go, if a car is suitable for unleaded fuel, it'l be fine on LPG (thats from 29 yrs converting vehicles) the only time I have had to replace a vaporiser it was a BRC one, make sure converter is LPGA registered & issues a CPO11 certificate for your insurance, (window sticker also) in my experiance allways go for a '4 hole' tank, the latest kit will use the cars own mapping for the fueling, making it far more accurate, other stuff runs on the llambda sensor for calibration & correction. |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by Octavian_P on Feb 29th, 2008, 9:29am @jonnycab Maybe you want to take a trip to Romania in a vacation, and put the LPG system here The newest generation sequential systems which use the car mapping etc. costs around 400 pounds (560 euro) + 40 euro (30 pounds) for the optional toroidal tank instead of normal tank. The prices are final and includes labor and warranty. And as the final cherry on the cake, the time in which the system is fitted is around 3 hours plus 1 hour of tuning, adjustment and checking ! Also you can get the small filler plug which gets hidden next to the gas tank filler, so no more holes ;) A very good LPG system is TOMASETTO + Stag 200 (newer version features STAG 300). |
||
|
Title: Re: Goodbye Scorp or hello LPG ? Post by martin_rowe on Feb 29th, 2008, 2:12pm 3 hours, think somethings lostr in translation. small filler with adapter is not LPGA COP11 complyant. |
||
|
Ford Scorpio Forum » Powered by YaBB 1 Gold - SP 1.3.1! YaBB © 2000-2003. All Rights Reserved. |